Shroud of Turin

[Zara B]

Hi Doles and all,

Doles, the aspect that you have highlighted refers simply to Al explaining in prior posts that he will be receiving Celestial (not natural or Divine Love spirits) input and has taken this position and yet, shows little respect for other peoples' experiences. The problem is that if such opinions such as the Shroud or books are stated by Al -- then why would we respect what he then has to give from his own voice or spirit? And so, he risks isolating himself from readers if they have come from different walks of life and experience to bring them into his Sanctuary.

From what Al has said he is not going to listen, change or grow and it is not my place to go on with this any further. It has been his Achilles Heel all his life.

Much love,
Zara

[Geoff]

Dear Zara,

Well if by that post you mean you are leaving, I think that is extremely sad. If you are saying that there is no point in beating Al up anymore, you are probably right.

hugs
Geoff

[Geoff]

I don't think Zara knows me well at all, we met briefly for an evening in Melbourne last January and I'm also beginning to wonder if Geoff does either. I think I am pretty much misunderstood ...

Dear Al,

I think this is the heart of things. You are to 99.999% of people exactly what they read, or read into on this board. That's the way it is. You cannot assume that people will "understand" because they know you outside of this cyber world. I know your heart is in the right place, but I still state my opinion here based on what I read here.

hugs
Geoff

[DennisT]

I think it's time to close this thread as we are no longer discussing the purpose of the thread, the Shroud of Turin.


However, for those of you with a deep need to continue the discussion about Al, maybe you can start a new thread titled: "Al Pot Shots" or the like (for our non-English or English-as-a-second-language readers, the definition of pot shot is: "A criticism made without careful thought and aimed at a handy target for attack") (meaning, this is supposed to be funny, folks!)

This site is all about God's Divine Love, and although I can feel the passion in all the posts of this thread, I'm not sure I'm feeling the Love

So what do you say we just close this thread and move on to more productive discussions about how we can obtain more of God's Great Gift into our souls.

Group Hug!!!
Dennis

[Zara B]

Hi Geoff,

No, not leaving the site just the commentary.

Much love,
Zara

[Geoff]

Dear Dennis,

We don't have to close the thread, but it is time to move on.

hugs
Geoff

[lizaduff]

Hello dear friends,

Although you may all know this, I'll share this, just in case some of you do not: Revelation 11, from the "New Testament Revelations" received by Dr. Samuels in 1955:

I am here, Jesus:

Yes, it is and I am glad that you have given me this opportunity to write, as I have been present for a short while and reading with you as you were reading Dr. Barbet's book on the crucifixion, and I would like to say at this time that the shroud at Turin is a reality, the shroud which covered my mortal remains after the descent from the cross and the preparations made for my burial by Joseph as described in the Gospels. The care for my body as described by John in Chapter 19, verses 38-42 is correct. The nails that pierced my flesh were hammered into the wrists and not the palms as has been widely understood; that physical death came to me through asphyxiation, due to the unnatural position of my body dragging on my outstretched arms on the cross, and that the opening of my heart by the Roman lancer and the accompanying flow of blood from the right auricle and the liquid from the pericardium actually took place as described by John the Apostle in Chapter 19, verse 34.

I say again that, while my sincere and devoted Dr. Barbet has accomplished a task of primary importance in the reconstruction of the crucifixion such a reconstruction deals merely with the experiences undergone by my body, and does not deal with the living soul, so that how much more important is it to devote oneself to the reconstruction of man through the experience of the New Birth and to study those things which will, by deed, lead him to eternal life. The great compelling fact of the crucifixion is that, while my body was dematerialized by me and died as to its existence, yet my soul has lived on through the intervening centuries and will continue to live throughout all eternity, and this eternal life became a reality through my constant and fervent prayer to the Heavenly Father for the inflowing of His Divine Love into my soul and At-onement with Him.

For while my body has these many centuries been returned to the elements from which they proceeded, and is no longer in existence as such, or can be brought back into existence through any such mysterious ceremony as the blood and wine now practiced among religious cults, nevertheless what is really alive is my immortal soul, with my teachings which show the way to achieve immortality of soul longing to the Father for it is the Divine Love that gives eternal life, and not that bread which is material, which as experienced by my body, suffers decay and is subject to the laws of the physical and hence transitory world.

II

The information regarding my true resurrection has already been given to mankind in the messages which, with my approval, were given through Mr. James E. Padgett and printed in True Gospel Revealed Anew; and these explain my work in Joseph's cave, ascended to the spirit world to proclaim the availability of the Father's Love through prayer and the possibility of At-onement with Him thereby, and then returning to the cave, materialized a body closely resembling my own with elements drawn from the elements of the universe; the linen shroud which had covered my body I folded neatly and placed in a corner and I walked out of the cave, the stone blocking the entrance to it having been rolled away by the bright spirit sent by the Father for that purpose; and it was in this way that I saw Mary the Magdalene and the others, as mentioned in the gospels. The angel mentioned in the gospel was a bright spirit sent for the purpose of removing the stone; the strength he displayed in this task was obtained through the transmission of energy conveyed to him by many spirits who were present at the time. His materialized spirit body, endowed with this additional power, was able to cope with the task of rolling away the stone. He used the guard whom he put into a trance by suggestion, as the means by which he obtained the necessary ectoplasm to bring about the materialization. No, he was not able to materialize by culling from the elements a material form, such as I was able to do in my resurrection, and no one other than myself, not even the exalted spirits of the Transfiguration, has done this.

It was necessary for me to do this to show that I was still alive even after death through crucifixion for at this time in their spiritual development this phenomenon was the proof in the eyes of my disciples that I was the Messiah; but the real understanding of my Messiahship came to them only at Pentecost, when the Divine Love was conveyed into their souls with such power and in such abundance that they knew I had come to bring the very essence of the Father to mankind if they would seek it through earnest prayer.

This became known later as receiving the Holy Spirit, erroneously, of course, because it is the Holy Spirit which conveys the Father's Love into the soul of he who seeks it; but even this became relegated to a secondary position before the great fact of the "Risen Christ" which was preached to the pagans to substitute for their own gods.

Spiritualism if properly understood and taught, must lead to prayer for the Divine Love and At-onement with the Father; and what more appropriate introduction to the Father's truths is there than that which reveals my resurrection -- the risen Christ -- as the working of a fundamental truth of Spiritualism

Jesus of the Bible
and
Master of the Celestial Heavens

[AlFike]

Time to move on folks. I will reiterate that it is nice that we have the shroud and it's even more wonderful that we can know Jesus in a personal and tangible way. That's the gist of my comments and cannot possibly see where the controversy is other than my inept use of language. I think the key is to keep my comments brief and not elaborate for fear of criticism and others getting the wrong idea. Yes I believe my heart is in the right place and my intentions are to stay positive. My challenge is to be mindful of how my words may be interpreted by others and this thread has been a great lesson in this regard. Since we are all individuals with different mind sets, it is inevitable that we will all take something different from what is being said. If we have a negative view of another then that will colour our interpretation. Like wise with the positive. The mind is a powerful filter and can inhibit the flow of love very easily. Acceptance and wisdom comes with the Divine Love. Need I say more. God bless.......Al

[Joseph]

Dear friends,

I pray that this thread will not be closed or deleted. Allow me to say why I pray that this be so.

I am childlike in my faith and understanding of the power of the Divine Love to transform our soul, which is our true identity, our true self, our identity as a human. However, I am one who does not believe that this transformation happens "automatically" and without a great deal of change in our lives, personality or what have you. So, having made this brief statement, I do not wish to see this thread removed because I see that it has revealed stuff in the midst of being changed and transformed. Celestial individuals don't act and say the things that we do to each other, at least I don't think they do. And that is where we are heading, namely, to be transformed into Celestial beings. Can this happen on earth? Though I haven't met a person that has made the transition into a divine angel while on earth, I still believe that it is possible. In the meantime, I, you, each one of us is in the process of becoming a divine angel. Sometimes this process can get quite stinky and smelly, at least this is my experience thus far.

The amazing part for me will be to watch and see how we grow and progress in our soul development as the result of things said and implied within our communications within this thread. Is love - the Divine Love - still the power in our lives to bring about change for the good for each and every one of us? Is the Divine Love only for individuals but not for interpersonal relationships? What does it mean that we have a portion of the Divine Love and yet we do not love and respect and honor one another (even when or especially when we expose some of our strange beliefs)? Oh no, I probably should not have written the last sentence, for it can easily be turned around and used as ammunition to continue to hurt or belittle a brother or sister's beliefs.

I think I have said enough. I hope this thread is not closed, or hidden from view. It is, I feel, food for our soul development and growth. I love you, each one of you.

Joseph

PS The above was being written while Elizabeth and Al were writing and posting their recent additions to this thread. I hope it adds to and does not distract from the excellent posts by Elizabeth and Al. With love, JB.

[Doles]

Dennis wrote,

So what do you say we just close this thread and move on to more productive discussions about how we can obtain more of God's Great Gift into our souls.

You may have a point, although I'm of the thinking that disagreements are part of productive discussions, if not THE productive discussions themselves. You see, I happen to think that learning to live with our disagreement might be one of our reasons to come or be here in the first place. I think of how less mentally developed persons, i.e kids settle their disputes as opposed to mature people. We all know our differences are at the core of most wars. I think we might've come here to appreciate and perfect agreement, but I would think our disagreements are the ones that need work. I've grown to respect and appreciate our disagreements because they reveal the beauty of diversity. Obviously disagreeing for the sake of disagreeing does no one any service. I love to step by and watch the maturity of people being able to respectfully settle disagreements with the understanding that we might genuinely see things differently. You appreciate the fellowship thereafter even more in my opinion. No, it's not about instigating...it's about growing in respect of others, appreciation for others and maturity. And for that I appreciate Al, Geoff, Zara, Dennis et al showing wisdom of understanding and love.